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Permalink Reply by Paula Deming on 4th mo. 3, 2012 at 2:02pm

I am holding you in prayer, Friend James.

 

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Permalink Reply by Nenad Knezevic on 4th mo. 3, 2012 at 2:14pm

James,

I'm glad you raised this issue. My spiritual path has also been circuitous. I "discovered" Quakerism and became convinced while I was active in an Anglican church. After about 10 years of juggling between church Services and Quaker Meetings and trying to definitively opt for one or the other, I realized that I was probably never going to be able to do that, for a number of reasons, some of which you can probably guess. People from both MfW and the church assured me they were absolutely fine with the option of dual membership, and so eventually I asked to be formally accepted as member in RSoF while keeping my name on the church electoral roll.

Many Quakers in Europe seem to have dual membership, retaining their previous denominational affiliation like that, certainly quite a few of the Friends I personally know. I don't know how common it is elsewhere in the world. In any case, I'm quite happy with the arrangement now.

Nenad

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Permalink Reply by Irene Lape on 4th mo. 4, 2012 at 8:09am

James, I was interested to read your post. Your situation is quite different from min in some ways, but I too have moved to the place where I feel called to be part of two religious communities. For me the two are the Catholic Church and my Quaker Meeting. I wrote a book about my journey - Leadings: A Catholic's Jurney Through Quakerism. My "witness," such as it is, is that the obsession with establishing a church that was the True and Original intention of Christ has only led to division and pride. There are aspects of Christ's presence and truth in all the different denominations, but the Body of Christ is cross-denominational. The important things for me are to keep a contact with a tradition that goes back to the time of Christ; and to keep to a more personal relationship with Christ that I can share with a smaller community of people who are committed to living out God's call as best they can, and who wrestle with the doubts and uncertainties that are part of our faith life. 

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Permalink Reply by James M. Branum on 4th mo. 4, 2012 at 11:17am

Thanks!

Paula Deming said:

I am holding you in prayer, Friend James.

 

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Permalink Reply by James M. Branum on 4th mo. 4, 2012 at 11:20am

I really like the idea of the home meetings. My wife and I have both wanted to find ways to be more hospitable than we are now (both of us can be a bit reclusive if we don't push ourselves to not be) so this might be a really good thing.

And I like the idea of maybe a bit of hybrid thing. This really is the issue, because I love the anabaptist emphasis on community (my little congregation does that well, eating together most Sundays, and often getting together during the week) but also love the Quaker emphasis on direct connection with the Divine. Maybe we could have a meal together and then some time for MfW?

Alice M Yaxley said:

Dear James Branum, thanks for writing. I'm also married, with a small child, and involved with both Quaker and Anabaptist communities. A thought that crossed my mind is whether a group of either community (or maybe even a mixed group) would be willing to come to you - would you be open to say, asking some people to your house one evening a week to pray/worship and eat together? I have found the Anabaptist group here particularly keen to include and very gently involve my small daughter so I can come to their meetings. Not that it solves the discernment problem for the future - best wishes with that - but a supportive prayer group might help whichever way you feel led?

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Permalink Reply by Diane Plassey Gutierrez on 4th mo. 9, 2012 at 8:57pm

This discussion is so contemporary and typical of our lives today!  

Intellectually and spiritually, Quakerism answers a need that is not addressed by the more evangelical and fundamental churches that draw my family and friends in the culturally Deaf community. 

Perhaps one of these days I will find a universalist type of church attended by the Deaf community.  For now, it can be a challenge to share religions that expects a more structured outlook  in order to be with the people that speak my language. 

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Permalink Reply by Matt Grant on 4th mo. 11, 2012 at 3:11pm

Hi,

I grew up attending Methodist & Anglican churches - I ejected from these in my early twenties and took up a loose affiliation with the Unitarians, and they kept me within the Christian faith as I questioned things.

In recent years I have become increasingly drawn to the Quakers - indeed, that one passsage, "I no longer call you servants, because a servant does not know his master's business. Instead, I have called you friends, for everything that I learned from my Father I have made known to you." often brings tears to my eyes as I think it reflects how I feel with the Quakers I am coming home, how they are helping me grow towards a new understanding.

But then again, it's hard for me to leave the Unitarians and declare myself convinced. The Unitarians, for all my frustrations, are a welcoming bunch with a great intellectual tradition behind them (Martineau, Channing, Parker et al). So I exist now in a half-way or eclectic state. I've decided that if / when the time comes that I become a  Friend, in the fullest sense, then this is what God wants. I've decided not to over-think it or forcibly push it.

I tend to call myself a 'Free Christian' (look it up on wikipedia if you're curious) - the Unitarians provide me with a religion of the mind, the Quakers a religion of the heart. I think this state has made me more tolerant and less sectarian, less concerned with finer details - I've even attended a traditional Catholic mass and an Anglican charismatic service in the past six months!

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Permalink Reply by kevin roberts on 4th mo. 11, 2012 at 7:13pm

james, is the problem that you feel you must choose one and abandon the other, because anything less than full commitment is flawed? what if neither set of beliefs or practices is complete, according to god?

in the bhagavad gita, krsna has this to say to arjuna:

Abandon all varieties of religion and just surrender unto Me. I shall deliver you from all sinful reaction. Do not fear.

does your dilemma concern an undecided understanding of god, or an undecided choice of human communities to join with?

since you describe yourself as a universalist, i'm not sure exactly what the difficulty is.

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Permalink Reply by Paula Deming on 4th mo. 11, 2012 at 7:17pm

Kevin speaks to my condition.

kevin roberts said:

james, is the problem that you feel you must choose one and abandon the other, because anything less than full commitment is flawed? what if neither set of beliefs or practices is complete, according to god?

in the bhagavad gita, krsna has this to say to arjuna:

Abandon all varieties of religion and just surrender unto Me. I shall deliver you from all sinful reaction. Do not fear.

does your dilemma concern an undecided understanding of god, or an undecided choice of human communities to join with?

since you describe yourself as a universalist, i'm not sure exactly what the difficulty is.

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Permalink Reply by Joan Gunn Broadfield on 4th mo. 15, 2012 at 9:56am

James, it is interesting you ask this.

There was a time when my YM (Phila) 'legislated' against it. (The Faith and Practice said you could not.) 

In the 1980s, I learned that England has a very different practice.  There is not the 'forbid' - in fact, there are Catholics who are members.

In our last (1996) version of F&P I brought this forward, and thought we simply said:

Requests for dual membership
Membership is a major commitment to participate in a particular community of Friends, and full participation in two religious bodies at once is usually impractical.

However, this was added in the process -  Except in unusual circumstances, a member of Philadelphia Yearly Meeting belongs to a particular monthly meeting and should not hold membership in any other religious body, including another monthly meeting.

I hope we soften this a bit.  We had a marvelous 'member' who every week went to the Church of the Advent in Swarthmore on the bus, and on her way back to her apartment, she would stop in and worship with us; she attended our potlucks, our events, and in her 80s was more active than many members - and she contributed to us and to the YM.  As far as we were/are concerned, she was a member.  She felt very much like part of the Beloved Community - which our Meeting feels is what it's all about.

So keep praying and discerning, Friend! ;o)

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Permalink Reply by Mark Russ on 4th mo. 16, 2012 at 1:29pm

Thanks James. When I saw the title of this thread my heart leapt a little, as this is a subject very much on my mind at the moment.

I came to Quakers when I was 17, and was an experience of 'coming home'. At that time I wasn't a Christian. My reason for originally exploring Quakerism was that I new they'd welcome me as a gay man and I didn't have to 'believe' anything. Since then, 12 years later, I've come to a point where I identify as Christian. I'm still in love with Quakerism in theory, but in practice I'm becoming a bit disillusioned by the liberal-humanist outlook that is becoming more commonplace in British Quakerism. I want to hold on to Quaker insights and practices, but be in community with others who retell and re-live the Christian story. Being a Christ-centred Quaker in England is increasingly difficult. My dilemma is of a different nature to yours I think, but I feel for you as someone pulled in two directions. All the best with your search for answers!

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Permalink Reply by Victoria Pearson on 4th mo. 16, 2012 at 10:28pm

i am multiply engaged with a number of traditions, and i think it's all right. the question that i think i am avoiding is-- what tradition do i want to struggle in? so i engage as i can, and avoid some of that struggle. i know that at some point this will change, though my personal practice may not change. Friends speak to my condition in many ways, and more explicit traditions and rituals make sense for me at different times. until i am powerfully moved, i don't think i will join a meeting just yet. 

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