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Permalink Reply by Rosemary Gould on 5th mo. 26, 2010 at 6:38pm

Yes. I feel so much of this, too. Outrage, fear, grief, remorse. You would think even a simple instinct for self-preservation would make people want to make big changes. I don't understand it.

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Permalink Reply by Rosemary Gould on 7th mo. 14, 2010 at 3:01pm

Hi Luke,
Welcome! I agree that the double standard is the essence of the problem. Although I think in the US, anyway, it's different than it is in Europe--by which I mean that we care as little for people in poverty in our own country as we do for people elsewhere. For instance, this year the administration made the decision to renege on the billion dollars for HIV/AIDS medication in Africa that was promised. Not coincidentally, some US states have also chosen to stop caring for people with HIV/AIDS. Perhaps, more and more, there will be not rich countries and poor countries, but instead the rich of the world and the rest.

I don't want to only be pessimistic about it. I very much admire Paul Farmer and Partners in Health for the way they are intervening all over the world. What models do you think are most hopeful?
Rosemary

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Permalink Reply by Rickey D. Whetstone on 7th mo. 20, 2010 at 6:30pm

Hey Guys

I've read all the comments on this discussion. And I have a question to add to this discussion?

How many sharing of resources and wealth demonstrations did Jesus organize?

Is the life of Jesus the standard that we should try to live?

Thanks

Rick

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Permalink Reply by Rosemary Gould on 7th mo. 20, 2010 at 7:31pm

Hi Rick,

Could you say more what you mean by 'sharing of resources and wealth demonstrations?' As I see it, Jesus asked the rich, over and over again, in each of the gospels, to share their wealth with the poor. (See, for example, the parable of Lazarus and Dives, or the Sermon on the Plain in Luke's Gospel.) John the Baptist said if you have 2 coats, give one of them away. If the life of Jesus is the standard, that would mean living without a home or an income other than what people were willing to give, wouldn't it? The Son of Man possessed even less than the foxes and the sparrows.
Rosemary

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Permalink Reply by Joanna Hoyt on 7th mo. 20, 2010 at 8:00pm

Patty,

I'm glad to see this discussion under way, and I don't know how I managed to miss it until just now. The question of right sharing has shaped my life considerably for the past few years. I'm still not where I think I need to be. A few things were relatively simple to do. I'm part of a very small community where we produce food and firewood to use and to give away to people who lack it; where we've sometimes taken in workers injured in producing commercial food; where we try to teach people how to grow, build etc. more for themselves and to live with less. Those things were straightforward. The car, the computer...the manufacture and use of those still requies people to do work I wouldn't be willing to do, and places to be exploited as I wouldn't want my place exploited. And yet I haven't laid them down yet.

I sometimes find myself in a place of outrage, especially when we have guests from very different privilege levels in rapid succession. After eating with people who've really gone hungry it is very difficult to sit with people who take food and throw it away--this is true literally and metaphorically. But my outrage is generally altered, if not eased, by the recognition that my own life is still far from just.

Can you say more about what practices you've taken up to promote right sharing, or what practices you'd recommend?

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Permalink Reply by Rickey D. Whetstone on 7th mo. 21, 2010 at 9:43am

Yes, . . . living the life style is the solution . . . public protesting just causes bitterness and strife for both sides . . . passing legislation is not the solution . . . Jesus said in Matthew 26:11 "the poor shall always be around."

Lazarus in the parable ended up where? In Heaven. Where did the rich man end up? In Hell.

Being rich with things here on earth is a big problem for the rich, their treasures will drag them to hell . . . if they worship their treasures.

Abraham was a very rich man . . . spiritually and monetarily speaking. And we all know where Abraham ended up in Heaven.

So . . . if we correctly understand that the environment, that we were placed in by God . . . is a test . . . for all of us . . . rich or poor . . . smart or slow . . . handsome or ugly . . . healthy or ill . . . young or old . . . clumsy or graceful . . . to determine . . . if . . . if . . . we will love all men unconditionally or will we love . . . with conditions attached?

I'm not writing this to correct anyone's thinking or lifestyle. I am not a judge . . . I judge no man.

I hope this sheds some light to your question on how I see life on this planet.

Rick

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Permalink Reply by Patty on 8th mo. 9, 2010 at 8:46am

I hesitate to answer your question of what practices I've taken to promote right sharing, because I'm in a position to need, rather than to be able to contribute. I feel like that costs me credibility. People could suspect that I only care about this because I'm one of the vulnerable people in need, and that I wouldn't care as much if I were financially secure. That isn't the case. I just have a very strong sense of justice.

I'd recommend certain practices based on what I'm experiencing, namely, that our social safety net is in tatters. I'm living with the constant threat of homelessness. My housing situation is very precarious. I've applied for public housing in the county where I live, but the waiting list is several years long. I publish ads on Craig's List regularly seeking housing in exchange for some kind of personal assistance help, but if I get replies at all, they're offers of prostitution---sex in exchange for housing.

As I'm going through this, I don't understand why the well-off balk at offering financial help one-on-one, directly, to someone they know is facing financial hardship. People calling themselves "liberal" and "enlightened" say they don't object to paying taxes for government social services, and they'll donate to charities, and that's fine. But why do they resist helping someone they know who needs help, and is deserving of help? I move in affluent and wealthy social circles fairly regularly. A number of them know what I'm going through. They know I've worked hard for years to overcome disadvantages, and that I'm dealing with obstacles. They'll give lip service to how "courageous" they think I am, that it's too bad I'm having a hard life, and problems like these are serious and we need to remedy them. But they don't do anything. They stand by and watch while I face the possibility of homelessness.

I do work, by the way. I'm underemployed, though. That's a complicated situation, and if anyone wants to know more, I'll tell them about it in a private message. I'm also diagnosed with Asperger's, and though there is an upside to it in my case, it presents challenges in work-related matters.

Joanna, to answer your question about what I'd recommend, one thing I'd recommend is innovative microphilanthropy. This is what I would do if I were wealthy: I'd pay attention to the people in my life. It wouldn't take long for me to make acquaintance with someone in need. I'd observe how they live, and I'd get to know what kind of character they have. If I saw that they were hard-working, honorable, responsible people suffering undeserved hardship financially, I'd give financial help, and what kind would depend on their situation. Every situation is different.

I can tell you that my own situation would be far worse than it is now if, through the years, well-off people who saw how I was struggling hadn't helped me with microphilanthropy. People here and there did just what I suggested above. They saw that I was hard-working and responsible and that I'd made a huge, sustained effort to pull myself out of the poverty trap, but that I'd had a lot of bad luck along the way. They helped me out financially. Some of these people weren't wealthy. They were doing well and they were affluent, but they were on budgets, but they helped as much as they could. I'm indebted to all of these people, and along the way, I always swore that if I became well-off, I would remember how much their financial help meant to me, and I'd do the same for others.

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Permalink Reply by Rosemary Gould on 8th mo. 9, 2010 at 4:53pm

Micro-loans are wonderful. There's evidence from developing countries that they do more good than all other forms of aid combined. I think people are unwilling to offer direct financial help because they want their charity to be tax-free. They also want someone else to do the screening for responsible assistance. Maybe they don't trust themselves to do it. Maybe they also believe that non-profits have a greater effect, that their dollars go farther.

I don't agree with that, any of it. Non-profits are often excellent, but they tend to distance people who give from people who receive so that no relationships develop between them, which seems very negative to me. Plus, lots of the money goes to the salaries and bricks and mortar of those organizations.

One of the things I like about the catholic worker movement is the belief in "personalism," that you do what you do yourself, person to person, not through institutions.

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