Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Mackenzie on 6th mo. 7, 2012 at 2:55pm

I don't actually think the marriage is happening in a religious setting. Catholics can't remarry without an annulment, and my dad is not interested in telling the lie that he never loved my mom in order to get an annulment.

I'm fine with dressing differently for a wedding than for everyday, but I still prefer to keep the skirts at Catholic-school-length (2 inches above kneecap), even if I'm laxer about arms and shoulders (though I still really ought to finish crocheting that shrug for covering shoulders when dressing up fancier). If I recall correctly, my black dress is 44" long and ends just above my knees.

Permalink Reply by G.H. on 6th mo. 8, 2012 at 9:30am

Thank you for your responses. Right now  I'm sitting with this leading  and waiting... Mackenzie, I too have a wedding to attend this summer. I'm the mother of the groom. Thankfully, it's not formal at all, so we're not expected to all match. I found a dress I can feel comfortable in yay!

Permalink Reply by Paula Deming on 6th mo. 8, 2012 at 10:30am

Mother of the bride in August. :) 

 

I too find that dress horrifying, MacKenzie, and would have when I was in my 20s as well. Both not simple and immodest. And unfeeling to make a woman wear it. I like Jenna's suggestion of a way to be involved but not forced into something so contrary to your leading.

You can't see it in my photograph, but I am wearing the dress I bought for weddings and such. A medium blue silk suit that comes to the knee. (Interestingly, when I shop for dresses for special occasions like weddings and funerals, the conservative default seems to be the knee.) I think of myself as modern plain, according to Isabel's definition, but I guess for special occasions I'm just simple.  I plan to wear this suit to my daughter's wedding too.

G.H. said:

Thank you for your responses. Right now  I'm sitting with this leading  and waiting... Mackenzie, I too have a wedding to attend this summer. I'm the mother of the groom. Thankfully, it's not formal at all, so we're not expected to all match. I found a dress I can feel comfortable in yay!

Permalink Reply by Mackenzie on 6th mo. 8, 2012 at 11:11am

This is the kind of dress I suggested sewing for everybody

http://shop.henkaa.com/collections/convertible-dresses-short

(It says short, it means knee-length...they also sell mini and ankle-length versions)

I like that "for special occasions I'm just simple" :) That sounds like me. My guest-of-a-wedding dress is a yellow, sleeveless (but wide shoulder straps) knee-length dress with a square neckline just below the collar bone. (though last wedding I went to, since it was brother of someone for whom I wore the yellow dress, I wore a pink knee-length strapless dress with a shoulder-shawl I knit)

Otherwise, I mostly dress like the cardigan picture on here http://quakerjane.com/spirit.friends/plain_dress-modern.html  (though with a t-shirt under the cardigan...I should probably change that as having bare arms is exactly what makes me need a cardigan, but then that'd involve buying lots of new shirts, which would be rather expensive, and kind of wasteful...the old ones have been with me for nearly a decade and are still going strong... cheaper/simpler for me to knit a cardigan...so I did)

Permalink Reply by Elin Hagberg on 6th mo. 8, 2012 at 2:32pm

I think your dress is not just prettier but it is also more considerate as people can have a saying in how much skin they show. I would accept at least two version of that dress myself even though just under the knee is a borderline length to me.

I am sad that your family does not understand your feelings in this.

Mackenzie said:

This is the kind of dress I suggested sewing for everybody

http://shop.henkaa.com/collections/convertible-dresses-short

(It says short, it means knee-length...they also sell mini and ankle-length versions)

I like that "for special occasions I'm just simple" :) That sounds like me. My guest-of-a-wedding dress is a yellow, sleeveless (but wide shoulder straps) knee-length dress with a square neckline just below the collar bone. (though last wedding I went to, since it was brother of someone for whom I wore the yellow dress, I wore a pink knee-length strapless dress with a shoulder-shawl I knit)

Otherwise, I mostly dress like the cardigan picture on here http://quakerjane.com/spirit.friends/plain_dress-modern.html  (though with a t-shirt under the cardigan...I should probably change that as having bare arms is exactly what makes me need a cardigan, but then that'd involve buying lots of new shirts, which would be rather expensive, and kind of wasteful...the old ones have been with me for nearly a decade and are still going strong... cheaper/simpler for me to knit a cardigan...so I did)

Permalink Reply by Betsy Packard on 6th mo. 8, 2012 at 4:13pm

You may be off the hook for the skimpy dress.  When I tried to pull up a photo, I got the message that the product was no longer available!  Divine intervention?  ;-)

Elin Hagberg said:

I think your dress is not just prettier but it is also more considerate as people can have a saying in how much skin they show. I would accept at least two version of that dress myself even though just under the knee is a borderline length to me.

I am sad that your family does not understand your feelings in this.

Mackenzie said:

This is the kind of dress I suggested sewing for everybody

http://shop.henkaa.com/collections/convertible-dresses-short

(It says short, it means knee-length...they also sell mini and ankle-length versions)

I like that "for special occasions I'm just simple" :) That sounds like me. My guest-of-a-wedding dress is a yellow, sleeveless (but wide shoulder straps) knee-length dress with a square neckline just below the collar bone. (though last wedding I went to, since it was brother of someone for whom I wore the yellow dress, I wore a pink knee-length strapless dress with a shoulder-shawl I knit)

Otherwise, I mostly dress like the cardigan picture on here http://quakerjane.com/spirit.friends/plain_dress-modern.html  (though with a t-shirt under the cardigan...I should probably change that as having bare arms is exactly what makes me need a cardigan, but then that'd involve buying lots of new shirts, which would be rather expensive, and kind of wasteful...the old ones have been with me for nearly a decade and are still going strong... cheaper/simpler for me to knit a cardigan...so I did)

Permalink Reply by Elin Hagberg on 6th mo. 9, 2012 at 4:23am

Haha! Let's hope so!

Betsy Packard said:

You may be off the hook for the skimpy dress.  When I tried to pull up a photo, I got the message that the product was no longer available!  Divine intervention?  ;-)

Elin Hagberg said:

I think your dress is not just prettier but it is also more considerate as people can have a saying in how much skin they show. I would accept at least two version of that dress myself even though just under the knee is a borderline length to me.

I am sad that your family does not understand your feelings in this.

Mackenzie said:

This is the kind of dress I suggested sewing for everybody

http://shop.henkaa.com/collections/convertible-dresses-short

(It says short, it means knee-length...they also sell mini and ankle-length versions)

I like that "for special occasions I'm just simple" :) That sounds like me. My guest-of-a-wedding dress is a yellow, sleeveless (but wide shoulder straps) knee-length dress with a square neckline just below the collar bone. (though last wedding I went to, since it was brother of someone for whom I wore the yellow dress, I wore a pink knee-length strapless dress with a shoulder-shawl I knit)

Otherwise, I mostly dress like the cardigan picture on here http://quakerjane.com/spirit.friends/plain_dress-modern.html  (though with a t-shirt under the cardigan...I should probably change that as having bare arms is exactly what makes me need a cardigan, but then that'd involve buying lots of new shirts, which would be rather expensive, and kind of wasteful...the old ones have been with me for nearly a decade and are still going strong... cheaper/simpler for me to knit a cardigan...so I did)

Permalink Reply by Sarah Rosemary Ann Zimmermann on 6th mo. 10, 2012 at 8:52pm

This is a pragmatic suggestion and doesn't really add to the ideological discussion, but have you asked whether she's willing to pick a specific color for the bridesmaids' dresses, and then allow the bridesmaids to pick their own styles? I know David's Bridal, for instance, standardizes its colors across product lines to allow such choice, and I've heard of many brides doing that sort of thing to accommodate different shapes, sizes, and mores of their maids. 

That really is a skimpy dress even by ordinary standards of modesty (let alone religious ones), and perhaps she can be flexible!

Permalink Reply by Mackenzie on 6th mo. 26, 2012 at 11:51am

She picked out a different dress. It's knee-length in front and ankle-length in back.

Permalink Reply by Emele W. on 6th mo. 29, 2012 at 4:39am

You're very much not alone. I have been wearing plain dress in some incarnation, on and off, for nearly four years now. No one in my social circle dresses plain.

It's something that I struggle with.

At any age really, but often as a young person, it can be a real struggle to follow leadings that set you apart from your peers. It's limiting my social interaction; I have no desire to waste my time drinking my life away, or any other number of particularly popular group sports. My friends and co-workers are kind, they try to include me in their activities, but many of them are completely unsuitable for my beliefs and proclivities. And yet, however conscience damaging after the fact, I have the occasional off desire to humor them for fear of offending them.

I worry about being frumpy and unattractive. I worry that it will drive off any possible romantic prospects, or that I'll alienate long time friends who are slowly becoming dissimilar by the day. Fears (real or otherwise) that I embarrass family or friends are hard to reconcile. All things that I've ruminated on over the years, always coming back to the fact that I've never been happier living a healthy and God focused life when dressing plainly. It forces me to think about my actions, about what God wants for me in life rather than what I want for me in life. Why should I sacrifice my modesty for acceptance? But then I worry that idea itself is rather prideful...

Permalink Reply by Barbara Smith on 6th mo. 29, 2012 at 6:48am

Emele - I appreciate all the thoughts about plain dress. As for romantic prospects I think it is rather the opposite if what you are looking for is a lasting relationship. If someone is scared off by your dress they are most likely not the one for you! To be honest I fretted about this with my now happily married 30 yr old daughter. She has been dressing modified plain her whole life, even through the years at a secular college, and I was in awe, both at her apparent obliviousness to what other thought and to her apparent total comfort with it. But potential mates? Well.... Then several years later Mr Right comes along and I'm sure the dress was a flag for him - here she is finally! God's plan is not thwarted by plain dress, of course.

You answered your own doubts right there when you said many of your friends and co-workers are "unsuitable for my beliefs". Again, I can see, and am experiencing, that if the dress is an issue in any way, those aren't the right folks, the right activities etc.

I have not thought about embarrassing anyone with the way I look, just myself! I've been getting a rash of strange stares lately, some amazingly unselfconscious - like mouth hanging open kind. It seems God at times leads me to breeze along with no one even noticing, and then I encounter blocks of this kind which remind me how I look. Not sure why.

I have pretty much stopped analyzing all this since I wrote this post. Now it is coming to be "me" and it feels like this is how I was always meant to be. I've never been more comfortable in my life, actually. I'm feeling the tug to more plain and moving a bit in that direction, though not historically-accurate plain exactly. But it pleases me.

I appreciate your last paragraph about being forced to think about your actions. This happens to me minute by minute and I could not have made the progress spiritually that I have made without it, I'm sure of that. God is leading and I believe is using this as a laboratory to teach me the amazing art of being led!

Thank you for your input,
Barb

Permalink Reply by Timothy on 6th mo. 29, 2012 at 9:18am

My wife had the same worries and fears when she started to dress plainly. She especially felt it most when she began to cover her head. It was a change. It was new to her.

She wondered if she would still be attractive, or pleasing to me. She wondered if she was feminine. She worried about what I, and others too, would think of her. It troubled and bothered her for a long time.

As she started to go forth as the Lord God and Heavenly Father directed, she began to see that I was not in the least repulsed, repelled, or thought of her as "unattractive" or not pretty any longer. In fact, quite the opposite, she found out I was faithful and true. She found that, being dressed in long dresses, and covering her hair did not change the Spiritual, Emotional, and Physical charm or beauty she possessed.

I appreciate thy comments and thoughts thee expressed. It cometh close to home. . . It causeth me to recall those former days, where nearly every day I'd hear: "Am I still pretty to you?" It was difficult at the time, but in looking back, it served a purpose. Yea, thou hast worded thyself well here. It reminds me of the very same things as I remember Hilda, my wife, thinking and saying.

Yet to follow the Lord of Light in this area is not necessarily prideful. It is a change at first. It is a challenge. Be strong and courageous in the Lord. Let Him Guide thee in all thy life. It is not drab or frumpy, to follow after the leading of God. It is a laboratory to teach the art of suffering (allowing) God to Lead thee or any of ye, like Friend Barb worded it.

Be faithful to Him. He shall continue to be faithful to thee. He is always available with listening ears to our silent prayers, groans, or prayers aloud. Continue to Ask, Seek, and Knock. God understandeth our endeavors, our undertakings, our feelings, our connections with others, and our connection to Him. The Messiah said: "Come unto me all ye that labour and are heavy laden and I will give you rest. . ." He can accomplish, by faith, what we see as impossible. It does take patience and time. So, rest ye in the Lord God, sister Friend (and Friends), in the God of all Comfort. . .

We care what happens to thee Emele and Barb and all of ye. Trust in the Lord with all thy hearts. Take care.

In humbleness and sincerity Thy Friend in Christ,

Timothy

Emele Williams said:

You're very much not alone. I have been wearing plain dress in some incarnation, on and off, for nearly four years now. No one in my social circle dresses plain.

It's something that I struggle with.

At any age really, but often as a young person, it can be a real struggle to follow leadings that set you apart from your peers. It's limiting my social interaction; I have no desire to waste my time drinking my life away, or any other number of particularly popular group sports. My friends and co-workers are kind, they try to include me in their activities, but many of them are completely unsuitable for my beliefs and proclivities. And yet, however conscience damaging after the fact, I have the occasional off desire to humor them for fear of offending them.

I worry about being frumpy and unattractive. I worry that it will drive off any possible romantic prospects, or that I'll alienate long time friends who are slowly becoming dissimilar by the day. Fears (real or otherwise) that I embarrass family or friends are hard to reconcile. All things that I've ruminated on over the years, always coming back to the fact that I've never been happier living a healthy and God focused life when dressing plainly. It forces me to think about my actions, about what God wants for me in life rather than what I want for me in life. Why should I sacrifice my modesty for acceptance? But then I worry that idea itself is rather prideful...

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